Those Among the Gentiles Go To Zion. Those Among Judah Go To Jer-USA-lem.

In previous posts about the final gathering I have pointed that there will be two separate and distinct gatherings of God’s people. Both take place in America.

It is important to understand this prophetic topic because it is about to unfold. Indeed, the preliminary spiritual and philosophical division is taking place right now.

One of the most succinct scriptural narratives that speaks of this dual gathering is found in Section 133.

Section 133 was given to the saints of the restored church while the fulness of the gospel was on the earth on November 3, 1831.

It was given in the middle of the 3 1/2 year revelatory sweet spot that Joseph Smith enjoyed from June 5th 1831 when the Melchizedek Priesthood was restored for the first time during Joseph’s ministry, until  December 5th 1834 when the Lord pronounced the members and leaders of the church to be under condemnation.


Section 133 was first added to the Doctrine and Covenants as the appendix by way of commandment from the Lord. The condemned modern church has since departed from the commandment to keep it as the appendix. They have corrupted the canon of scripture by removing the Lectures on Faith and other inspired revelations and by adding some uninspired revelations. They have also failed to maintain section 133 as the appendix.

Section 133 begins by addressing the saints of the restored church in Kirtland:

1 Hearken, O ye people of my church, saith the Lord your God, and hear the word of the Lord concerning you—

2 The Lord who shall suddenly come to his temple; the Lord who shall come down upon the world with a curse to judgment; yea, upon all the nations that forget God, and upon all the ungodly among you.

The Blessing and the Cursing

Notice the prophecy about that Lord coming to his temple with a curse to judgment.

That prophecy was fulfilled when Christ and three ministering angels visited Joseph an Oliver a years later in the Kirtland Temple.

During this visitation a blessing and a cursing was placed upon the gentile nations that have departed from the Lord, including the ungodly among the restored church.

Section 110 informs us of blessings that took place relative to the appearance of Christ and three angelic messengers. In addition to the blessing, Elijah the Prophet appeared to Joseph and Oliver and informed them that he had come to the earth prior to the great and dreadful day of the Lord as prophesied by Malachi.

The revelation directs us to the other prophecies in Malachi that speak of the cursing. Notice how Malachi informs us that the cursing is related to the act of changing the saving ordinances and the law of tithing (consecration):

7 ¶ Even from the days of your fathers ye are gone away from mine ordinances, and have not kept them. Return unto me, and I will return unto you, saith the Lord of hosts. But ye said, Wherein shall we return?

8 ¶ Will a man rob God? Yet ye have robbed me. But ye say, Wherein have we robbed thee? In tithes and offerings.

9 Ye are cursed with a curse: for ye have robbed me, even this whole nation.

The Lord will Make Bare His Arm

In the above prophecy, “Mine ordinances” appears to refer to the saving ordinances of the gospel in the latter days which includes the three fold baptism. The next passage in section 133 prophesies of an upcoming event that begins the third watch (dispensation) when the Lord will make bare his arm in the eyes of all nations.

For he shall make bare his holy arm in the eyes of all the nations, and all the ends of the earth shall see the salvation of their God.

The term “holy arm” of the Lord refers to God anointed servant that will be returning to complete his missioin.

The following verse begins with “wherefore” which actually implies a continuation of the third watch prophecy being spoken of in verse 3 above. It provides a brief outline of how the final gathering will take place in the third watch:

4 Wherefore, prepare ye, prepare ye, O my people; sanctify yourselves; gather ye together, O ye people of my church, upon the land of Zion, all you that have not been commanded to tarry.

5 Go ye out from Babylon. Be ye clean that bear the vessels of the Lord.

6 Call your solemn assemblies, and speak often one to another. And let every man call upon the name of the Lord.

7 Yea, verily I say unto you again, the time has come when the voice of the Lord is unto you: Go ye out of Babylon; gather ye out from among the nations, from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

The saints of the restored church assumed this commandment to gather was referring to their current situation and it certainly was applicable since God was in the process of gathering his saints out of Babylon at the time. However, the literal fulfillment of the above commandment/prophecy had reference to a future time, referred to in scriptures as the third watch.

All of the Tribes of Israel will Gather to the Promised Land of America

The passages above speak of a worldwide gathering of believers to the land of America that takes place when the final restoration and marvelous work referred to by Isaiah begins to take place. America is the land of the Abrahamic Covenant in the last days. That is why ALL of the tribes of Israel will gather here.

At that time, the first laborers of the last kingdom will emerge to fulfill their commission of gathering the elect from the four corners of the earth.

Interestingly, most LDS prophecy scholars believe that the times of the gentiles is about to come to an end and then the Gospel will go to the Jews.

This is not correct.

The times of the Gentiles that began with the New Testament apostles came to its fulness during the ministry of Joseph Smith between 1831 and 1834. At that time the fulness of the gospel was collectively rejected by the Gentile saints of the restored church.

After that the saints petitioned the Lord in the dedicatory prayer of the Kirtland Temple to begin to redeem Jerusalem from that very hour and return the children of Judah to the lands of their inheritance in America.

One week later the dispensation of the Gospel of Abraham was secretly ushered in as documented in Section 110.

Shortly thereafter the revelation commissioning the Twelve Apostles to take the knowledge of the gospel to the house of Israel which Joseph Smith identified as the “outcasts of Israel” and the “dispersed of  Judah” was given in section 118.

Since that time, remnants of Judah and other tribes have been gathering into the modern church.

The words of Christ to his New Testament saints as recorded in Section 45 validates the above scenario.

It informs us that the Jews that scattered after rejecting Christ during the meridian of time, were to remain in a scattered condition until the times of the gentiles were fulfilled.

That fulfillment of the times of the Gentiles took place during Joseph Smith’s ministry. (D&C 45:24-25) following that, the House of Israel (Jews ) have begun to believe in Christ and to gather into the church.

However the narrative in section 45 goes on to reveal that the times of the gentiles will come in AGAIN after the signs of the coming of the Lord begin to manifest themselves with wars and rumors of wars great commotions in the earth!

From this and other passages of scriptures we learn that the times of the Gentiles are about to come in again.

After the signs appear, a LIGHT shall break forth.

“And when the times of the Gentiles is come in [AGAIN] a light shall break forth among them that sit in darkness, and it shall be the fulness of my gospel.”

That is what is about to happen right now!

The times of the gentiles is about to come in again!

The light of the Marvelous Work is about to shine forth!

The fulness of the gospel is about to return to the earth!

Section 133 informs us that when the final restoration and gathering takes place, the third watch begins by calling upon the gentiles first, and then upon the Jews:

8 Send forth the elders of my church unto the nations which are afar off; unto the islands of the sea; send forth unto foreign lands; call upon all nations, first upon the Gentiles, and then upon the Jews.

9 And behold, and lo, this shall be their cry, and the voice of the Lord unto all people: Go ye forth unto the land of Zion, that the borders of my people may be enlarged, and that her stakes may be strengthened, and that Zion may go forth unto the regions round about.

10 Yea, let the cry go forth among all people: Awake and arise and go forth to meet the Bridegroom; behold and lo, the Bridegroom cometh; go ye out to meet him. Prepare yourselves for the great day of the Lord.

11 Watch, therefore, for ye know neither the day nor the hour.

First the elders call upon the Gentiles and then upon the Jews. Both are called upon to gather and prepare for the great day of the Lord.

Again, it is important to understand that everyone from all the tribes of Israel are first gathered to America, the land of the Abrahamic Land Covenant.

The passages above provide a great key to understanding the underlying tribal division between those among the gentiles and those among Judah.

Both groups believe in the Book of Mormon and the LDS restoration movement.

The prophetic narrative in section 133 reiterates once again that there will be two divisions among believers of the LDS restoration. These two groups will gather to two separate and distinct geographical places within the promised land of America.

12 Let them, therefore, who are among the Gentiles flee unto Zion.

13 And let them who be of Judah flee unto Jerusalem, unto the mountains of the Lord’s house.

14 Go ye out from among the nations, even from Babylon, from the midst of wickedness, which is spiritual Babylon.

As you can see, the chronology pertaining to the gathering of the believing Gentile and the partially believing Latter day Saint (Jew) is reiterated once again.

First, those who are among the Gentiles will flee to Zion.

That is the first harvest.

Following that, those who are of Judah, will flee to Jerusalem and the mountains of the Lord’s house. (terms having to do with the Jerusalem in America, not the Old World. Joseph Smith identified the Kirtland area as the latter day Jerusalem)

Signs that Reveal the Coming of the Lord

Section 45 informs us that there will be signs in the heavens above and in the earth below at the time of the gathering just before the return of the Lord.

Interestingly, there was an eclipse tat took place on August 21st of this year that many Christians and Mormons believe to be one of the signs of the end times.

Seven years later a second eclipses will take place in April of 2024

The trajectory of the first eclipse goes directly over Independence Missouri (Zion).


eclypse independence 2017.png

The trajectory of the second eclipse that takes place seven years later goes directly over Kirtland Ohio (Jerusalem).

eclypse kirtland 2024.png

It is my belief that it is not coincidental that these two signs in the heavens cross over two of the most prominent places having to do with the LDS restoration movement. In fact, they may identify the location and chronology of the two harvests that will take place in America.

X Marks the Spot

The the intersection of these two trajectories may well represent the “sign of the cross” which some apocryphal accounts associate with the sign of the coming of the Son of man.

Furthermore, the fact that the general geographical location of the intersection is over the area of the LDS restoration movement appears to be an ominous sign to the world that the LDS restoration and coming forth of the Book of Mormon and ministry of Joseph Smith was a divine work. Most prophecy scholars believe these two eclipses represent a pending judgment over the nation of America.

The exact place of the intersection brings to light the fact that even though modern revelation identifies Missouri as the land of Zion, and identifies the “center place” and the “place of the temple“, their may be other prominent places in the land of Zioin that have never specifically revealed in scripture.

It may be that the Lord never identified the exact location of a significant end times location that was not identified during Joseph Smith’s ministry. This may be because the Lord knew the saints would reject the fulness and be unsuccessful at that time in gathering.


eclypse cris cross

If you zoom into the area that is marked by the cross, you will see several cities that are not apparent as places of significance during Joseph Smith’s ministry and the attempted gathering to the land of Zion.

One of them for instance is an obscure place called “Jackson City, Missouri“, not to be confused with “Jackson County, Missouri“.

It had a population of a few hundred people during the time of Joseph Smith’s revelatory sweet spot when the fulness was briefly on the earth. It was the first city to be named after President Jackson.

One of my readers has pointed out that another place very close to the center point of the X is located by Jerusalem Road in Jackson County, Illinois in the unincorporated area of Pomona.

I make brief mention of this because the scriptures identify the general land of Zion and the Center place and the site of the future temple, but there may be other prominent cities in Zion to be built in the future that have not been revealed.

The exact center of the X could be identifying an important place in the future.

Nevertheless the main point is that there are to be two gatherings and associated harvests in America and the two eclipes may be identify the gathering places. One group of believers is of Ephraim and they are classified among the gentiles. The other group is of Judah. Many of them have been greatly deceived about their true tribal identity and they think they have been given the birthright of Joseph and Ephraim.

It is my belief that one cannot comprehend the mystical meaning of the above prophecy unless one has an understanding of the secret history of Mormonism and who the real Jews are and where the real JerUSAlem of end times prophecy is.

One needs to understand how the gentiles rejected the fulness of the gospel in Kirtland followed by the promulgation  of the knowledge of the fulness of the gospel to the dispersed of Judah and the outcasts of Israel (as documented in sections 109, 110, 112 and 118).

foreign 1

It is through the second wave of missionary work to those of the House of Israel located across the great waters that those of Judah began to be gathered to America and into the condemned church during the Nauvoo and Utah eras.

One can only understand the prophetic narrative in the passages above by understanding that the modern corporate church that calls themselves the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter day Saints, contains the Jews in the latter days who have BEGUN to believe in Christ.

The Book of Mormon cryptically informs us that the Jews (that call themselves the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter day Saints), have only begun to believe. They cannot fully comprehend and live the fulness of the gospel. 2 Nephi 30:7

The Two Witnesses Come at the Time of Restoration

Because of their blindness and partial belief and unwillingness to repent and receive the fulness, these latter day Jews will be visited and chastised and warned by the two witnesses mentioned in the Book of Revelation.

This final warning to the partially believing Jews who call themselves the latter day saints, takes place when the final time of restoration takes place during the Marvelous Work and a Wonder. Joseph Smith had this to say about the appearance of the two witnesses to the Jewish nation at the time of restoration:

15 Q. What is to be understood by the two witnesses, in the eleventh chapter of Revelation?

A. They are two prophets that are to be raised up to the Jewish nation in the last days, at the time of the restoration, and to prophesy to the Jews after they are gathered and have built the city of Jerusalem in the land of their fathers. D&C 77:15

America is the land of the Abrahamic Covenant. It is the latter day land of all of the tribes of Israel including the Jews who first begin to believe in Christ BEFORE they gather. Again, sections 109 and 110 inform us that the true gathering of the Jews in the latter days began in about 1836.. It begins because they believe in Christ even though they cannot live the fulness.

The notion that the gathering of the Jews in the latter days began in 1947-8, in the Old World Jerusalem BEFORE the Jews begin to collectively believe in Christ, is not congruent with prophecy and is false. It completely contradicts the Book of Mormon and the D&C. It is a smokescreen that has been set up by the Vatican, the U.N.,  and the Ashkenazi Jews that run the global fiat banking system that has enslaved the people of this earth. 

The beginning passages in Section 133 testify that all of the tribes of Israel will be gathered to America. A type of this was provided when Joseph was sold into bondage and was followed to the new land of bondage by his brethren of the other tribes.

That was a type of how remnants of Joseph among the Gentiles would be carried to the land of America in the latter days and that eventually the other tribes would follow them to the land of America. America was to become a land of hidden bondage to God’s people until the final time of restoration and gathering should take place.

When the dispensation of the fulness of times is finally ushered in during the final restoration, Gods saints that have gathered to America from among the gentiles nations will flee to Zion.

Following that, God’s people among the latter day kingdom of Judah will flee to the land of Jerusalem that is also located in America!

All of this is about to take place.

The elect of God are about to be called out by the elders of God’s church that was in existence in November of 1832 as unconditionally promised in Section One of the Doctrine and Covenants. The protocol and chronology having to do with the calling out of the elect will take place as declared in sections 88, 109, 133, and other sections.

Section One begins by giving us the prophetic narrative of what happens when the Lord’s disciples who had published the Book of Commandments, return in the 3rd watch to declare the voice of warning.

They shall declare that the saints have strayed from the true ordinances and broken the everlasting covenant:

1 Hearken, O ye people of my church, saith the voice of him who dwells on high, and whose eyes are upon all men; yea, verily I say: Hearken ye people from afar; and ye that are upon the islands of the sea, listen together.

2 For verily the voice of the Lord is unto all men, and there is none to escape; and there is no eye that shall not see, neither ear that shall not hear, neither heart that shall not be penetrated.

3 And the rebellious shall be pierced with much sorrow; for their iniquities shall be spoken upon the housetops, and their secret acts shall be revealed.

4 And the voice of warning shall be unto all people, by the mouths of my disciples, whom I have chosen in these last days.

5 And they shall go forth and none shall stay them, for I the Lord have commanded them.

6 Behold, this is mine authority, and the authority of my servants, and my preface unto the book of my commandments, which I have given them to publish unto you, O inhabitants of the earth.

7 Wherefore, fear and tremble, O ye people, for what I the Lord have decreed in them shall be fulfilled.

8 And verily I say unto you, that they who go forth, bearing these tidings unto the inhabitants of the earth, to them is power given to seal both on earth and in heaven, the unbelieving and rebellious;

9 Yea, verily, to seal them up unto the day when the wrath of God shall be poured out upon the wicked without measure—

10 Unto the day when the Lord shall come to recompense unto every man according to his work, and measure to every man according to the measure which he has measured to his fellow man.

11 Wherefore the voice of the Lord is unto the ends of the earth, that all that will hear may hear:

12 Prepare ye, prepare ye for that which is to come, for the Lord is nigh;

13 And the anger of the Lord is kindled, and his sword is bathed in heaven, and it shall fall upon the inhabitants of the earth.

14 And the arm of the Lord shall be revealed; and the day cometh that they who will not hear the voice of the Lord, neither the voice of his servants, neither give heed to the words of the prophets and apostles, shall be cut off from among the people;

15 For they have strayed from mine ordinances, and have broken mine everlasting covenant;

As you can see from the above passages, it is the Lords disciples that published the revelations contained in the Book of Commandments and Doctrine and Covenants that will be the ones to return to raise the final voice of warning and seal up the wicked.

Verse 7 provides this ominous warning that the servants will verily return

Wherefore, fear and tremble, O ye people, for what I the Lord have decreed in them (Joseph and his Brethren that published the revelations) shall be fulfilled.

Later in this section the Lord would once again warn us that every unconditional promise and prophecy in his Book of Commandments would be fulfilled:

37 Search these commandments, for they are true and faithful, and the prophecies and promises which are in them shall all be fulfilled.

38 What I the Lord have spoken, I have spoken, and I excuse not myself; and though the heavens and the earth pass away, my word shall not pass away, but shall all be fulfilled, whether by mine own voice or by the voice of my servants, it is the same.

39 For behold, and lo, the Lord is God, and the Spirit beareth record, and the record is true, and the truth abideth forever and ever. Amen.

The Elect Will Be Gathered BEFORE the Day of Tribulation and Desolation

The above declaration that the founding disciples of the restored church will be the ones to return and gather God’s elect had already been established in an earlier revelation.

That unconditional promise of God given through Joseph Smith in the presence of six elders as contained in Section 29 states that those seven elders will gather out the elect BEFORE the day of tribulation and desolation takes place!

4 Verily, I say unto you that ye are chosen out of the world to declare my gospel with the sound of rejoicing, as with the voice of a trump.

7 And ye are called to bring to pass the gathering of mine elect; for mine elect hear my voice and harden not their hearts;

8 Wherefore the decree hath gone forth from the Father that they shall be gathered in unto one place upon the face of this land, to prepare their hearts and be prepared in all things against the day when tribulation and desolation are sent forth upon the wicked

Those passages in Section 1 and 29 and other sections, inform us how the elect will be gathered to Zion in preparation against the day of tribulation and desolation.  But what about those of Judah within the LDS church that will also be gathered out to ultimately go to the “mountains of the Lord’s house” located in America?

You may be thinking to yourself that the modern corporate church (which represents the latter day kingdom of Judah) is light years away from being gathered anywhere because they have no plans to gather anywhere and they are not anticipating Zion.

Further, prophetic scripture seems to indicate that they will reject the true servants of the Lord and they do not seem to understand the signs of the times around us.

You may be thinking that the modern church suffers from complacency and seems to be doing the tango with Babylon and is oblivious to the fact that the season of the Lord’s return is upon us.

If you are an active latter day saint then you have noticed that the topic of Zion is seldom spoken about in church in a serious and passionate way as a literal event that is soon to happen.

Although that may be true regarding the general, mainstream, collective body of the latter day Jews, there is a remnant within the LDS church that is very much focused on Zion and is anxiously preparing to be gathered out.

They do indeed recognize the season of the Lord’s return and they are diligently making temporal preparations.

A Remnant of Judah is Currently Preparing for the Gathering

In this post I am going to put a spotlight on who they are and give you a synopsis of what their beliefs are and how they are preparing to be gathered out. Some of you may be part of this group.

I have a soft spot in my heart for these people even though I do not feel as if I am part of their tribe.

I know that they are a remnant of God’s people and he loves them very much. Ultimately, after their pain, they will be redeemed and saved in a kingdom of glory.

Interestingly, some of them think that the preliminary gathering out will begin this year.

I am very hopeful also.

I base my speculative conclusions on a different set of data than they do, nevertheless, we both have arrived at the same general timeline with regard to when major events will begin to happen.

Of course I have been speculating about the time that things will begin to happen for many years and I have the dubious distinction of batting 1000% in my speculative predictions.

They have all been wrong.

That is because I am not a prophet, I am a “Yankee Guesser” like BY.

Those of Judah Preparing to Gather have no Formal Organization

This remnant of Judah within the modern church is a rather loosely organized fellowship that sustains the current leaders of the LDS church as prophets, seers and revelators.

They congregate at preparedness fairs, Book of Mormon Conferences, Gileadi Lectures, and other similar events. They even sponsor special “Zion Camps” where fellow “preppers” camp out together for a week at a time to hear lectures from people like Mechelle (Shelle) McDermott and enjoy classes about a multitude of topics having to do with end times prophecy and physical preparations for the impending calamities  and the interim gathering out to tent cities.

Some of the main declarations coming from this group of people are as follows-

1- A huge earthquake is going to hit the Wasatch Front very soon followed by financial chaos, plagues, civil war and the invasion of America.

2- The leaders of the LDS Church will not warn the church about this calamity.

3- The more righteous in the church will be temporally prepared for this calamity and will be gathered to “tent cities” in designated “cities of refuge”.

The Leaders of the Church will not Raise the Warning Voice

Those are among the major points of belief and general mantra of this group of believers. Interestingly, they believe selected members of the church are currently getting their calling and election made sure.

Oddly enough, they don’t believe the leaders of the church will raise the warning voice just before calamity hits because they feel that the leaders of the church have already given an adequate general warning for many decades.

The following video titled “There Will Be No General Warning By The Prophet Before The Prophesied Calamities Strike” distills their belief about why the ordained watchmen on the wall will be silent and not offer the voice of warning prior to this great calamity.


Isaiah 52 and 62 informs us that the true watchmen of the latter days will lift up the voice of warning just prior to the calamities, yet Isaiah 56 speaks of latter day watchmen that are impostors.  He characterizes them as blind, ignorant  dumb dogs that cannot bark.

10 His watchmen are blind: they are all ignorant, they are all dumb dogs, they cannot bark; sleeping, lying down, loving to slumber.

11 Yea, they are greedy dogs which can never have enough, and they are shepherds that cannot understand: they all look to their own way, every one for his gain, from his quarter.

Although these latter day Jews are active in the modern corporate church and claim to sustain the brethren, several leaders of the church have warned the general membership to not pay any attention to them. The leadership has continually admonished members to rely exclusively on the brethren for all of their prophetic guidance.

Since this group of believers appears to be classified among the Jews that only begin to believe in Christ without accepting the fulness when it returns, they do not appear to take the unconditional promises and prophecies in the Doctrine and Covenants literally and seriously nor do they appear to believe in the return of Joseph Smith and his fellow servants of the first laborers of the last kingdom .

Because of this, the Doctrine and Covenants is a sealed book to them regarding the prophecies contained therein.

In some of the presentations the following listing of prophetic books of scripture is what they encourage their followers to study. You will notice that only one section in the D&C is even mentioned:

The Book of Revelation
D&C 45
Matthew 24
Mark 13

With the exception of Section 45, the above listing of suggested prophetic scriptures to read seems to avoid the prophecies contained in modern revelation.

You will notice that the following sections containing critical information about the prophetic events of the last days are missing in the suggested reading list above.

Section 1 (preface)
Section 29
Section 88
Section 101
Section 103
Section 105
Section 109
Section 110
Section 112

Section 118
Section 133 (appendix)

To be fair, those that call themselves “the remnant” represent a very broad category and it contains many sub-factions. They do not all believe exactly the same.

It appears as if most of them have discounted the significance of the prophecies contained in the above sections in part.

Many in this group of latter day Jews do not see any need for the leaders and members of the Church to collectively repent of any serious wrongdoing.

It appears to me as if the majority of this collective group, that consider themselves to be the remnant of God’s people, don’t think the church has changed the ordinances and broken the everlasting covenant as documented in section one, Isaiah 24 and the Book of MalachiThey seem to be virtually illiterate regarding the true history of Mormonism with regard to how early the restored church became condemned and then rejected as a church with their dead.

Many of them think the church membership still has access to the fulness of priesthood (even though the fulness of power and blessings have largely been dormant since the martyrdom) and that all that is needed to bring down the fulness of power is greater faith. They do not recognize a need for any kind of course correction or the return of God’s servants.

Some factions within this group are very much oriented towards a gathering that is led by a Davidic Servant of the Lord while others feel that no servant is necessary.

Where do they get their prophetic beliefs from?

Their beliefs regarding doctrine and the pending calamities and subsequent gathering to tent cities, come largely from the following sources

1- The writings of Avraham Gileadi
2- Podcasts, talks and writings of Mike Stroud
3- The writings and teachings of Val Brinkerhoff
4- Selected writings and talks of Ezra Taft Benson
5- The Book titled “Visions of Glory” by John Pontius
6- The dreams, visions and writings by Sarah Menet
7- The dreams, visions and writings of Julie Rowe
8- The dreams, visions, writings and lectures of Mechelle (Shelle) McDermott
9- A collection of hundreds of other visions which have been collected and published by Roger K. Young.
10- Selected statements about the gathering by Brigham Young and other Utah General Authorities found in Journal of Discourses.

Again, not all members of this loosely organized group believe the same way but many of them are influenced by the teachings of the following teachers.

Shelle McDermott seems to be a chief organizer of some of their conferences and she is one of the primary visionaries that speaks about the tribulations that are about to take place.

Mike Stroud seems to be the doctrinal patriarch of this movement. I would characterize him as the “Denver Snuffer of active Mormons.”

Temporal preparedness is hugely emphasized among these people.

Below is a video of talks that Mike Stroud and Shelle McDermott gave at a recent conference.


The following link is to a podcast that Mike Stroud gives about receiving one’s calling and election. He claims to have over 15,000 followers of his blog.

I refer to Stroud as the Denver Snuffer of active Latter day Saints because he emphasized some of the same things regarding the importance of seeing and conversing with God that Snuffer was teaching before getting excommunicated.

He teaches that selected Mormons are currently getting their calling and election (despite the fact that they don’t have the fulness of priesthood, don’t live the fulness of the Gospel and have been rejected as a church with their dead.)

Indeed, there seems to be a strong connection between the group taught Stroud and McDermott, and those that follow the teachings of Denver Snuffer. I have even been informed that some of them follow my blog, dispute the fact that I have a radically different religious world view from either of those groups.

Both Groups Call themselves the Remnant

The preppers are calling themselves “the remnant” and the Snufferites are also calling themselves “the remnant“.

I know of high profile people in this prepper group that are also secretly participating in the new Snufferite church and have received the new baptism protocol set forth by Snuffer. I think the Snufferites do lots of proselytizing among the preppers.

Interestingly, Mike Stroud repeatedly makes reference to the fact that he is being taught by a “holy man”, but refuses to reveal who this holy man is. He also claims to know some anonymous bloggers who teach about the importance of calling and election and the Second Comforter. It is possible that the holy man that is feeding information to Stroud is either Snuffer or one of Snuffers disciples.

Mike Stroud claims that translated beings are currently commissioning and ordaining people as part of the 144,000 servants of God.

He appears to be connected to an underground group of people who claim to have a special authority.

When asked about the Snufferites, Mike Stroud refused to condemn their movement or acknowledge them as apostates. Here is a question that one of his students asked him about the Snufferites and his response

Student 1: The group that is following Denver Snuffer, they think they’re that group? (the remnant mentioned in scripture)

Mike: Well, there may be some of them that are.

Student 1: How could they? How could they since they are apostatizing? Don’t you believe that they’re apostatizing?

Mike: I don’t know. I know some of those people, and I know that they are honorable people and their hearts are in the right place. I don’t know what the Lord is going to do there, but I do know some of them personally, and they are fine, good people and they have strong faith. Whether or not they have been deceived, and whether their doctrine is false, that is something between them and the Lord.

Would the Real “Remnant” Please Stand Up?

It is interesting that both the Preppers and the Snufferites have both chosen to call themselves “the remnant“.

The term remnant shows up throughout the scriptures in many different ways. The scriptures speak of the remnant of Jacob, the remnant of the Gentiles, the remnant of Joseph, the remnant of Judah, the remnant of Israel, etc. 

Other times the scriptures only refer to “the remnant”, requiring the student of the scriptures to do extensive keyword searching and employ the spirit of revelation to discern which remnant is being spoken of.

Herein lies the wonderment of how the term is being used among these two groups of people.

One of the few sections in modern revelations that is spotlighted along with prophecies from the other standard works among these two groups is section 45 wherein the term remnant is used.

As previously discussed, Section 133 speaks of two gatherings and associated harvests that are about to take place. The first gathering has to do with those of Joseph and Ephraim that are associated with the gentiles. The second gathering has to do with those of Judah.

In Section 45 the Lord cryptically refers to those among the gentiles as “my disciples”  that shall “stand in holy places“. Conversely, that same section speaks of “a remnant” [of the Jews] from Jerusalem that is scattered among all nations that are gathered into the LDS church AFTER the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled during Joseph Smith’s first ministry. Section 133 reveals that the believing remnant of Judah shall be saved and receive their inheritance AFTER their pain.

Both the Snufferites and the Preppers, have unwittingly referred to themselves as “the remnant” in the context of how it is used in Section 45.  This group of Latter day Saints feel they can receive the fulness of gospel blessings without living the fulness of the gospel. (additional passages that use the term remnant as it applies to the tribal identify of these two groups are  1 Nephi 10:14,  1 Nephi 15:13-14, 3 Nephi 16:4 & Rev 11:13


Fearful Outlook of the Events to Come

Among the many visions and dreams that create the fearful outlook of this group of people include the vision of John Taylor, the Cardston Temple vision by Sols Caurdisto, a vision by President George Albert Smith, the vision of Patriarch Charles D. Evans, the predictions of Bishop Koyle, the warnings of Apostle Moses Thatcher, the prophetic warnings and writings of Heber C. Kimball, and George Washington’s alleged vision of the invasion of America.

Huge emphasis is place upon the writings of John Pontius.

A typical last days presentation that incorporates the mindset of this group can be seen here

This group puts a huge emphasis on the role of Jewish Feast days in prophetic fulfillment. Among the prophetic signs and timeline speculations that are discussed within their meetings is the belief that the 70 Jubilees began in 1416 BC when God’s children entered Canaan and the fact that that time period has expired.

They believe a seventy year generation has nearly elapsed from the time the Jews began to gather to the Old World in 1948 brings us to the year 2018.

They also put a huge emphasis on the upcoming September 23 event.

Another important prophecy that leads many of them to believe that the era of the Messiah is upon us in 2017, is the one given 12th century Rabbi, Judah Ben Samuel.

A more detailed listing of their source material can be viewed here.  Additional resources are found here.

The following presentation was given by Mechelle McDermott in Arizona

The following statement by Brigham Young is typical of the types of predictions that this group is attracted to-

An inland Empire will be established in these valleys of the mountains, which will be a place of refuge for millions of people to gather to, when the great day of the judgments of God comes upon the earth, and the righteous come here for safety. Our people will go East…, West, North and South, but the day will come, when they will be glad to come back. We will be shut out from the rest of the world.” 

As previously stated, there are numerous movers and shakers within this movement, with Avraham Gileadi and Mike Stroud being among the most prolific teachers that are looked up to. Nevertheless, the unique thing about this group is that their prophetic worldview with regard to the pending calamities seems to be dictated primarily by three charismatic and visionary women who claim to have special gifts of the spirit and a connection to heaven.

Sarah Menet
Julie Rowe
Mechelle (Shelle) McDermott

These women love to share their visions and dreams to spell-bound audiences. There seems to be a real market for their special prophetic knowledge gained from their spiritual gifts.

Many members of the church who are watching for the signs of the times and seeking direction on how to prepare, are largely left frustrated and unsatisfied by the modern General Authorities of the Church and therefore are looking for like-minded people who recognize the signs of the times.

Modern leaders seem reticent to offer the voice of warning regarding impending doom. The voice of warning from the pulpit seems to be ever so subtle if not virtually non-existent with regard to an impending calamity.

In addition to being silent about warning people of any impending doom, leaders of the church have indicated that the writings and claims of these women should be considered to be “spurious” and “non-authoritative”.

In August of 2015 a memo was issued by the LDS Church Seminary and Institute Department titled “Spurious Materials in Circulation“.

This memo is updated periodically to clarify statements given by General Authorities, halt rumors about Church policies, or list books that were being used inappropriately in the classroom. Julie’s book fell into the last category.

Here is the actual statement:

Publication Caution: A Greater Tomorrow: My Journey Beyond the Veil
Additional Information: [August 31, 2015]

In 2014, Spring Creek Book Company published A Greater Tomorrow: My Journey Beyond the Veil by Julie Rowe (see shaded box for Amazon’s description of the book). Although Sister Rowe is an active member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, her book is not endorsed by the Church and should not be recommended to students or used as a resource in teaching them. The experiences she shares are her own personal experiences and do not necessarily reflect Church doctrine or they may distort Church doctrine.

A statement from the publisher of Julie Rowe’s book can be seen here.

Julie has since come out with the following statement:

“I agree that the Curriculum for LDS Church classes should only come from sources recognized by the LDS Church as being authoritative.  My story is not intended to be authoritative nor to create any Church doctrine.  It is simply part of my personal journey that I have chosen to share in hopes that it can help people to prepare for the times we live in by increasing their faith in Christ and by looking to our Prophet and Church leaders for guidance.”

—  Julie Rowe

According to one online commenter, their Stake President spoke with General Authorities regarding the claims of Julie Rowe and made the following statement:

“While I do not want to publicly disparage anyone for their personal belief and inspirations, read Jeremiah 23:32. I have been told by leadership that this is the case with Julie Rowe. 

“Behold, I am against them that prophesy false dreams, saith the Lord, and do tell them, and cause my people to err by their lies, and by their lightness; yet I sent them not, nor commanded them: therefore they shall not profit this people at all, saith the Lord.” Jeremiah 23:32:

It will be interesting to watch those that call themselves the remnant as the momentum builds and as we approach the end of the year.

Although I do not share their belief that you can ascend into heaven and claim the highest gospel blessings in a face to face relationship with the Lord until you have repented, entered into consecration and kept the full law of the gospel, I think their passion and sincerity in looking forth for the signs of the coming of the Son of Man set them apart from most Mormons.

One major question yet to be answered is whether the preppers will ultimately become a front for the Snufferite movement.

Another is will the preppers eventually depart from the main body of the church when they are gathered out.

It is very possible that they will simply remain in full membership and facilitate in preparing other Latter day Saint Jews for the gathering out when that time comes.

Regardless, I acknowledge their legitimacy as a latter day tribal entity.

I believe that they are fulfilling prophecy and that when the calamities do hit, they will probably be a huge catalyst with a huge effect upon others, regardless of how things play out.

I believe God loves them as a remnant of his people and my hope is that God will ultimately redeem them even if they must go through pain as a collective body of believers.

Section 45 informs us that at the time of Christ’s return in glory, these Jews will finally accept the truth. Because of this, they will abide the day of the Lord.

Praise God for his goodness and mercy.

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