Can I ask you for some help with chapter 27 in 2 Nephi? This whole chapter screams 3rd watch to me until I get to vs. 21 & 22, ” Then shalt thou seal up the book again, and hide it up unto me, that I may preserve the words which thou hast not read, until I shall see fit in mine own wisdom to reveal all things unto the children of men,”
this sounds more like the 2nd watch.
I went back to read the chapter again to see if there was a clear break when the lord is speaking about 3rd vs the 2nd watch, but I couldn’t find one. When I went back I found that vs 9 – 14 sounded like they could fit with Jospeh in the 1800’s , however vs. 15-19 didn’t seem to fit the 1800 events of the Book of Mormon.
So I’ve read again and again, but ‘m just not seeing it? If this chapter is all 3rd watch how does vs 21 -22 make sense, why would the book be sealed up AGAIN? If some of the chapter is 3rd and some 2nd I could see that, but I don’t see definitive lines drawn?
Great catch and great question.
I wrote a detailed post on this years ago but I cannot find where the post is LOL. I wish I would have developed some kind of catalogue by topic.
Isn’t there a third option (to the two preserved in the blog post): the intercessory atonement? Or have I misunderstood the concept?
[with reference to Are You Calling Joseph Smith a Liar?]
Adrian, the man behind “To the remnant” is of the opinion that Joseph never practiced polygamy, but that subsequent leaders have ascribed that behavior to him in order to justify their own sins. He also seems to imply that anyone that believes that Joseph was a polygamist and deceitful about it should expect today’s leaders to be the same.
I agree with Adrian in that Joseph Smith, the man, was not a liar. It was not in his nature to lie.
Thank you for getting back with me so quickly….
One more question that I’d like you’re thoughts on. In your opinion is Denver Snuffer a false prophet through and through, or could he have a message from Christ himself as he claims, that being that rebaptism is required for those who will be part of the true zion? I ask this because I wouldn’t have recently awakened to the knowledge that the current LDS church is in apostasy without the help of a good friend who is a follower of Denver Snuffer. He is convinced that Snuffer is a true messenger from Christ. I have investigated Denver Snuffer’s claims by reading his first lecture, nearly all of his blog, PTHG, and his lecture on Polygamy. I find that he teaches a lot of truth, but in my opinion also some false doctrine. I don’t believe that a true messenger would teach any false doctrine. Rather I think a false prophet would offer a great deal of truth, but would mix in key false doctrine to deceive even the very elect.
I have read through your rebuttal of PTHG and it was very informative. I actually took detailed notes on what was put forth in the book as I was reading it and noticed some key false doctrines, such as his bogus definition of how one progresses from belief to faith to knowledge (knowledge only coming from a visit by an angel or Christ himself). He defends that position from the Book of Mormon, but upon reading the passages he sites in defense of that idea it doesn’t hold water. Of course one can receive knowledge without a heavenly visitation. Also in German the words faith and belief are the same word Glaube.
I’m a torn between my concerns about Denver Snuffer’s teachings and my fear of damning myself by rejecting a true messenger of the Lord. I guess for me the jury is still out on Denver Snuffer. I would greatly appreciate your thoughts on the matter.
I have decided to not provide my response to this fellow at this time and I have asked him to not forward my reply to anyone. However, this is his response to my reply
Thanks for taking the time to break all that down about Denver Snuffer. Those where pretty much my thoughts about him, but I guess I was trying to leave the door open that he might be a true messenger just in case. Funny you should mention what you did about observing what kind of spirit is leading my friend. I have noticed that there is something off about him, especially when you look into his eyes. I had the impression he was being deceived about Denver a couple of days after I initially started to really wake up. I guess a part of me was desperate to latch on to a new true prophet and I hoped that inspite of my impression that Denver was that man. It certainly would be nice and much easier if he was. Your email just confirmed what I already new in my heart, but couldn’t quite bring myself to completely admit, and that is that Denver Snuffer is a false prophet. Now I can put him and his claims behind me and move forward. The Holy Ghost has confirmed that this is right. I will keep our conversation between us (accept for perhaps showing your email to my wife one day when she’s ready. Thanks for all your help.
I am going to purchase your book for my husband for Christmas and was wondering if the only edition available is the first? I found the link and password to purchase it but just wanted to confirm that is was the only one available before I purchase it. Please let me know.
I am so sorry the new edition is not done. I have had a real mental block and have had several distractions and don’t know when I will get it done. It is possible that it will be done in a few weeks but I cannot promise. If you decide to purchase the existing one now, send me a screen print of your receipt and I will mail you the updated one free of charge when it becomes available.